Curse

Evilsod · Apr 12, 2006, 10:19 PM // 22:19

I couldn't give a damn how easy skill points are to attain if i have to pay 1k for each frigging skill i want!

Just because i have 1.1mil in the bank doesn't mean i'm happy about spending it on skills to progress my character. I spend money on skills to farm, mess around, test builds, make new utterly pointless builds, etc.
My 55 ele build didn't just appear using a collection of skills i had, i had to do the quest to become E/Mo then go buy a few skills. This i did by choice, it was bad enough having to go buy Apply Poison on my ranger (first char) then finding out the skill was utterly f*cking useless against all the undead around!

aron searle · Apr 12, 2006, 10:19 PM // 22:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper008

Hm how about this

omg... read gaile's post,

EVERYBODY READ Gaile's post...

Much better? No

Hmmm how about you read his location, its belgium.

EternalTempest · Apr 12, 2006, 11:03 PM // 23:03

I spent a ton of money to buy all the War skills (my primary sub) that I could not get via quest in C1 for my sub and used a bunch of skill points.

The reason for this I was assuming that the system of going through factions the "traditional" way aka no running, fighting to the next zone + quest's would get me at least 50-75% of the new skills or be similiar to C1. If it doesn't.. going to have to farm some more .. but will see what happens when it actually comes out.

Fred Kiwi · Apr 12, 2006, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

From what I understand, Anet wants to cut down on "cookie cutter" builds by making skills harder to acquire.

All that's going to do, though, is discourage the use of new skills, because they are harder to acquire. People will post where the best skills are to be found, and that's the only skills people will get.

IMO, this "solution" will totally backfire, and it seems like a big step back from "skill, not grind."

^^ this what right here

Hella Good · Apr 12, 2006, 11:11 PM // 23:11

K... I play mostly PvP. Will do the PvE section just to see how "elaborate" the plot is this time (in other words, have something to joke about) and to cap some skills (always enjoyed that one a lot). Still bottom line is: how fast will I get faction?

I definitely have no patience to obtain the gazillions of faction required to unlock all the new skills (good news is half of the elites suck, so I'm not unlocking anyway). A simple calculation reveals that there is, what, like 10 new elites per profession-> 60 for the old professions. Thats like 60x3k= 180k faction...

i'd say i maybe need 100k faction just for the new core class useful elites... then u got 2 new professions of course... thats 150 new skills including bout 30 new elites or so... that's 90k faction in elites only. total is about 270k faction for all new elites or about 160-180k for the useful ones. now of course this doesn't include the other skills to unlock...

Well, I, for one, am going to hope ANet find a way to give us faction EN MASSE. Or I'm going to find me another game. Simple as that.

Mavrik · Apr 12, 2006, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

You can't make an Assassin in Tryia as it is only relegated to Cantha

The option to merge accounts was made available so that new characters had access to tryia and existing tryia characters have access to cantha.

if I am wrong... then I'm going to seriously be upset

Evilsod · Apr 12, 2006, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Making skills harder to get won't do a thing to stop cookie cutter builds. If at Anet they really believe this i suggest they start taking there medication. It just makes the richer able to get them faster and for the builds to take slightly longer to get up and running.

Seriously, are you gonna decide 'Nah on 2nd thoughts i'm not gonna bother capping these skills which will make me lots of money' just because they'll take you slightly longer to get hold of?

And if you think capturing the skills is cheaper, remember how much your paying for that signet of capture? Unless they make them free of charge and have plenty more bosses around that you can readily get hold of decent skills off, theres no way that this will work.

Mavrik · Apr 12, 2006, 11:52 PM // 23:52

Sig of capture is 1k or buying the skill is 1k... same thing lol

EternalTempest · Apr 13, 2006, 12:00 AM // 00:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mavrik

The option to merge accounts was made available so that new characters had access to tryia and existing tryia characters have access to cantha.

if I am wrong... then I'm going to seriously be upset

It's looking like there will be an point similiar to ascension as in C1 in C2. Once it reaches that point, you can take Asa/Rit over to C1. But not sure untill the game actually released.

Opeth11 · Apr 13, 2006, 12:03 AM // 00:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by viper008

Hm how about this

omg... read gaile's post,

EVERYBODY READ Gaile's post...

Much better? No

How about :

Oh my God. Read Gaile's post. In fact, why doesn't everyone just go read Gaile's post.

English is not always everyone's first language. However, I do like correcting some sentences at times. Common mistakes amuse me.

Back on topic, I would love to be able to purchase skills from vendors, as questing through that same area over and over seems a bit tedious to me.

edit : ok, somewhat back on topic >_>

Theus · Apr 13, 2006, 12:36 AM // 00:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Hey, guys,

Just to make things a little more clear, and show you that what you're concerned about isn't a big deal. Honest! I'll try to make a spiffy bullet list. Oh dear heavens, I do love my bullet lists:

Character level progression will be faster.
Skill points are acquired more quickly.
What we are doing is simply empowering you to make more choices. Rather than handing off the same two skills to every person for each quest, you get choices.
There will be a greater variety of skills offered earlier in the game. We actually help to offset the cost of acquiring skills by rewarding you with an amount of gold that will help you towards the cost of acquiring the skills.
- This is an exciting thing, because when you run into someone, you won't be able to predict build from A to Z. What he chose may be different than what she selected. More variety, again, is a good thing.
- And for those interested in unlocking, each character can choose skills that were not unlocked on the last character, expanding options for the account as a whole.

There! Not only is that a vision of loveliness as a bullet list it's packed with good info, too!

Quoted for the 5th page, and bolded for importance and to silence the idiots who have the inability to look through the thread and actually read posts before posting.

Hella Good · Apr 13, 2006, 12:45 AM // 00:45

Gaile's post doesn't answer how PvP players are going to cut through the factions bs, does it? Aside for some minor questing/capping on 1 char, I will not, and I MEAN I will NOT, waste my time going through dumb PvE to get my skills unlocked. Now, how does ANet solve the PvP issue I'm asking???

Banin Galori · Apr 13, 2006, 12:59 AM // 00:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hella Good

Gaile's post doesn't answer how PvP players are going to cut through the factions bs, does it? Aside for some minor questing/capping on 1 char, I will not, and I MEAN I will NOT, waste my time going through dumb PvE to get my skills unlocked. Now, how does ANet solve the PvP issue I'm asking???

There's a PvP issue? People have used faction to unlock PvP skills before, and will continue to do so. If you didn't like it before, you won't like it now, but everyone else is fine with it. The issue at hand has nothing to do with PvP at all. Hell, you might even get skills faster this way if you PvP, because you're not stuck getting the same skills through quests, but can immediately get what you want.

I see what Gaile is saying like this:

Before:
Quest: Do x.
Reward: Skill A, skill B.

Now:
Quest: Do x.
Reward: Mucho EXP for skill points, lots of gold to buy skill. Choose the skill(s) you want from NPC.

As much as selecting the skills I want is nice, though, I can't help but feel that the new system will still be inexorably slower than before. Unless, of course, the quests meant for skills give enough EXP for 2 levels and 2k gold, progress will inevitably be slower.

Hella Good · Apr 13, 2006, 01:27 AM // 01:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banin Galori

There's a PvP issue? People have used faction to unlock PvP skills before, and will continue to do so. If you didn't like it before, you won't like it now, but everyone else is fine with it. The issue at hand has nothing to do with PvP at all. Hell, you might even get skills faster this way if you PvP, because you're not stuck getting the same skills through quests, but can immediately get what you want.

There is a PvP issue? Hell, yea, there is!

The total worth of all new skills in Factions is roughly 500k faction. Do you realize how much that is??? Let me explain. I have been playing for over hmm... 1 year and I have like 300k faction total used. Mind you, I unlocked every single skill on 3 classes through PvE. Now... do the maths... If I am expected to do the same thing I did with last game just to be able to get my UAS, I'm simply going to find a better use of my time. Faction should come at much larger quantities to allow for PvP players to actually be able to enjoy the game rite away and not waste their time unlocking 300 skills the way it used to be be4. Kthx. Everyone else is fine? Wake up and smell the coffee... PvP players have been talking about this crippled faction system for ages.

Evilsod · Apr 13, 2006, 01:44 AM // 01:44

I haven't done PvP all that much and even i can agree with Hella Good that faction sucks. 1k for a normal skill, 3k for an elite. Seems fair, now the fact that it takes me 2hours to get this 1k faction... or longer if i have a bad PvP run.

I like doing PvE, plus when i deleted my monk i used his remaining skill points (along with 60k) to buy a shed load of mesmer and necro skills (then deleted him of course). In total i have somet like 50k faction, but im only about 10 skills away from getting them all and even now its taking me frigging ages!

To be fair though, Faction does come in larger quantities. The 12v12 battles give you a fair bit of faction, oh wait a moment, they last about 30 minutes each. Never mind then back to the drawing board.

sh4ft3d · Apr 13, 2006, 01:45 AM // 01:45

I kinda like the enjoyment of capping a skill after a hard fought battle or a few hours of grinding. It sort of seperates dedicated players from one who aren't.

Tuoba Hturt Eht · Apr 13, 2006, 03:11 AM // 03:11

In Factions, there better be enough quests that rewards:
- skill points
- gold
- both

Otherwise its gonna be a grind.
1,000 gold for a new skill ain't cheap.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

Hey, guys,
* Skill points are acquired more quickly.
* We actually help to offset the cost of acquiring skills by rewarding you with an amount of gold that will help you towards the cost of acquiring the skills.

We'll just have to wait and see how rewarding that "amount of gold" from the quest rewards will be, as well as the "skill points acquired more quickly".

Eet GnomeSmasher · Apr 13, 2006, 03:20 AM // 03:20

And for those interested in unlocking, each character can choose skills that were not unlocked on the last character, expanding options for the account as a whole.

Hmm, Gaile, if you ever come back to this thread, could you explain this a bit further? I'm confused by it and so are a few others. A few people have speculated on what it means, but it's just...speculation until you clarify it for us.

I'm hoping that there's a typo in that statement and that you mean to have said that PVE characters would have access to unlocked skills on the account.

Banin Galori · Apr 13, 2006, 03:28 AM // 03:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hella Good

There is a PvP issue? Hell, yea, there is!

The total worth of all new skills in Factions is roughly 500k faction. Do you realize how much that is??? Let me explain. I have been playing for over hmm... 1 year and I have like 300k faction total used. Mind you, I unlocked every single skill on 3 classes through PvE. Now... do the maths... If I am expected to do the same thing I did with last game just to be able to get my UAS, I'm simply going to find a better use of my time. Faction should come at much larger quantities to allow for PvP players to actually be able to enjoy the game rite away and not waste their time unlocking 300 skills the way it used to be be4. Kthx. Everyone else is fine? Wake up and smell the coffee... PvP players have been talking about this crippled faction system for ages.

Sorry, didn't realize you didn't like the original (and new, I suppose) PvP system either. But the point remains, however: The new system will let you choose the skills you want as a reward, while boosting your EXP gain and gold gain so you can actually buy those skills. This should be good for your PvP, because you can quickly get the resources to buy the skills you want, instead of getting stuck with the same old set every time.

On the other hand, people like me who like to unlock as many skills as possible will find a hard time doing so. The fact remains that so many skills were available through questing, so inevitably the new system would still lengthen the process significantly. I suppose Anet is letting us get a good build faster, at the expense of collecting skills - which, I suppose, I don't really like, though it might make the game last longer.

Still, I'm curious as to how this affects PvP so much. If you have a PvP build, you'll need 8 skills. Surely that's much faster to acquire in the new system, when those 8 skills can be the first 8 skills you get?

twicky_kid · Apr 13, 2006, 05:17 AM // 05:17

I've very disappointed to see this news. Skills are already too expensive. Before the change the increase was anywhere between 2-8g now after 300g its a 50g increase and caps at 1k. Before the change I had unlocked 3 proffesions for my monk and I was still at 700g a skill.

1k per skill was way too much. I understand some unlocked all the skills and they were above that cap but majority of GW players the cost for skills increased even more. To see that I must buy the majority of skills is probly a bad decision. They say they are going to make Skill points easier to aquire but the price of skills is going up because now we have to buy the majority of skills.

Faction is fine the way it is. Elite 3k non elite 1k. So for 10k I can buy an entire skill bar. That is not unreasonable. Especially since I'm gaining 800 faction per gvg battle.